The S60 order allows police at major demonstrations and football matches to "stop and search in anticipation of violence" and nothing else.

The police however employ this as a tactic to control, subdue and gain personal information about protesters, despite not really having the power to do so. Its effectiveness in the past has been due to no-one really understanding just how limited the police powers under an S60 order are.

In the event of an S60 order being issued, these are the important things to remember;

1. The police do have the power to search you for weapons (and dangerous instruments). They have no other powers under S60. They can only detain you "for as long as necessary to carry out a search".

2. They have no legal power to force you to give them your name and address. UNDER NO CIRCUMSTANCES give it to them - it will be kept on file for SEVEN years. When asked, say "NO COMMENT".

3. They have no legal power to force you to have your photograph taken. Do not allow them to do this. This too will be kept on file for SEVEN years. Keep your head turned away, or put your hand in front of your face.

4. They have no legal power to ask you to remove any item of clothing in public view, OTHER THAN that which is concealing your identity. Any facial masking can be confiscated. If you are asked to remove coats/jumpers etc, REFUSE OUTRIGHT.

5. They have no legal power to search wallets, purses, inside small pockets etc. This is an S60 search, for weapons only. If they ask to search wallets, purses, inside small pockets etc, REFUSE OUTRIGHT.

6. If you have a bag they will search that, but again for weapons only. Any other items, documents, potentially incriminating articles are OFF LIMITS. Do not allow them to examine any of your personal possessions (cash cards, student cards, diaries, organisers etc). This is not part of S60.

Under Article 8 of the UK Human Rights Act 1998 your privacy is assured. Make sure they know this. They can only confiscate weapons and facial masking.

7. They have the power to use "reasonable force" but ONLY if you do not submit to a search. No other force can be used for any other purpose.

8. They must tell you their name, number, station they're based at the reason for the search. Ask them for this. Not only will it piss them off but if they don't provide this information the search will be illegal.

Legal Update from the same site thea above came from:

While performing a search they _can_ ask you to remove outer clothing, such as coats and jumpers in public. In addition, s60(4A) - inserted by s25 CDA 1998 - allows the police to force you to remove anything they reasonably suspect you are wearing wholly or mainly to conceal your identity. There is nothing to stop you putting something else on after you have taken off a mask or had it confiscated.

5. The s60 search is for "offensive weapons or dangerous instruments". This is not limited to large things such as samurai swords and stun guns (taking examples from certain Sunday papers) but can include razor blades. They _can_ search inside wallets, purses, small pockets for these.

6. They _can_ search personal possessions for dangerous instruments that might be hidded inside and they can also seize prohibited articles such as drugs *. While it is true that Article 8 of the European Convention on Human Rights (ECHR) contains a qualified right of respect for your private life, and that under s6 of the Human Rights Act 1998 public authorities such as the police will be acting unlawfully if they breach any right in the ECHR, it is wrong to see this as doing something as absolute as assuring your privacy.

I'm sorry that we have to post this on the board and by doing so, I do not think for a second that anybody reading or posting here is in anyway involved in football related trouble.

However, it seems that policing is getting more draconian, match by match so while I hope you never have to use the below information, it is helpful to know it!

Amanda

As mentioned in the 'match day experience' thread, I had this on saturday at birmingham new street station. Wish I knew about number two and five before saturday, also didnt know about number 8. As we came off the platform up the stairs they let the slightly older generation (of about 30/40) get off and all lads my age got told to go to the left and we all got searched.

I didn't actually think we had a choice. I thought if i don't co-operate then they'll just put something else on me. What are they searching weapons for? since when did united fans carry weapons? I was searched twice. the guy who searched me once did it quite quickly and then I went to walk away, looked round to see where my mates were and then another officer came and i said ive already been searched, and he replied with well you don't look like you've been searched. Wtf am i suppose to look like after being searched? Do they give me some kind of badge?

The second time i got searched he asked what were in my trouser pockets, so i said phone, wallet, keys. So he searched my wallet, which i thought was a bit far. Also searched my coat pocket, where i had my train ticket and a few receipts.

My mate who got searched as well said yesterday that he was on sky sports news being filmed getting searched. He's said he'll try n get someone to sky plus it if it came on again.

What is it that actually goes on my file? that i entered new st station on the way to a football match. I thought with them taking my details would just be if I were to cause trouble then they'd no where i live. Im not a hooligan, so its not as if their going to need my details, but the way they went round arresting people for bascially fuk all, u never know.

Don't suppose you got the numbers of the coppers that seached you, did you?

Even if you didn't no harm in putting in a retrospective complaint....

No i didn't no.

But I will write to them anyway.

If you need any help putting together a letter, am sure Colin will lend a hand!

Mate i don't think they think we have weapons, as colin says, they just want your details and to also make you feel intimidated.

I wasn't searched as thoroughly as that when i was coming through the airport on the way over. Says it all really

If yor cops are anything like ours here in AUS, asking them for their identification will certainly piss them off. I've had mates at football games who have asked police for htier identification who have flatly refused (which is totally against the law) ofcourse my friends refused to co-opperate untill they got it, but still.

I have to say i had absolutly nothing against cops before i started going to footbal matches, cant say the same anymore though.

All the above is good in theory - but we all know that in the real world, anyone that doesn't co-operate with the police when they carry out the search will be arrested and charged with drunk and disorderly, or some other offense you cannot prove or provide evidence against. Your word against theirs.

And they are also meant to give you a S60 slip after you've been searched, to show any other officers that you've already been searched that day if they stop you later on.

I remember being searched 5 times in one day a few years back. Absolutely pathetic.

BHB - fair enough, you're unfortunately not wrong but, I'd stick my guns and let them arrest me...

Amanda the Martyr....

new st was ridiculous. about 50 cops to greet us as we got off the train. They then tell me and my dad to "stand over there" in a little corale of lads. nobody seems to be moving from this crowd but people ahead of us are having their fingerprints scanned with some device. after waiting for about 10 mins and noticing that several people have since wlaked through by offering themselves up to be searched i grab my dad and we do this. I'm searched reasonably thoroughly but then have to wait about 10 more minutes while they go through all my (52 year old) dad's posessions including emptying his wallet. Whilst waiting we'd been well and truly sniffed by the dog. Fortunately they didn't ask us for any details because i did remember reading this advice on here previously and was fully prepared for an argument.

So, it is abundently clear that the police are absuing their powers and taking advantage of the ignorance of supporters.

Shame On Them...

Shame on them, but really no different from the way they've treated football fans (and other protesters) over the years.

I know, Rob. And the courts ordinarily back them up..

What on earth did they hope to find in a wallet they shouldn't have been searching the first place? A razor blade, gram of coke? A brick? On a 52 year old out with his son?

Police set out thinking there is going to be trouble (living in the 70s). While what they should be doing is preventing trouble. Just yeah go there and make sure people see ya but none of this stopping crap and keeping away fans behide for 1 hour. And if there is trouble jsut step in and deal with it.

what the police actually do now in my opinion provokes trouble. You get a bunch of football fans drinking and having a good time and then 50 visored police with riot shields and batons form a line facing them - that's instantly going to provoke some reaction (albeit a non-violent one: singing, posturing etc.)
Same goes for pusing great crowds of fans around like cattle from one place to another. Where's the logic? "I know, let's take these 300 individuals and corale them together and force them to march somewhere they don't necessarily want to go". All you're doing there is pissing off 300 people and instantly giving them a collective mob mentality they didn't have before they were forced together. Madness.
It can be seen with stewarding as well. Whenever we're away and we score an instant army of stewards (often with police thrown in) line up directly infront of our end and spend the rest of the match staring us out. " minutes later you've got the whole away end singin "we're going on the pitch". This is directly caused by their completely unnecessary reaction to our scoring. "Oh tench, they're celebrating scoring a goal - quick, let's line up and stare at them" WTF!? :angry:

Yeah thats what I mean they see every football fan as a potential hooligan. All this
intelligence crap aswell. Where do they get this "intelligence".

The problem is that I always have a drink before football. Today I had just 2 pints but it is still enough for them to arrest me for D&D if I was to be arsey with them as I could never prove that I wasn't drunk.

Apparently, and as far as I'm aware intelligence is gathered by the two Forces FIO's swapping each others info re: banned supporters, possible numbers attending, recent history between the two sets of fans etc.

This relies on FIO's knowing what they are doing.

Reasonable grounds for suspicion

Most stop and search powers can only be exercised where the constable is acting on ‘reasonable suspicion’. This includes the power to search a person for illegal drugs under the Misuse of Drugs Act 1971 and the power to search for stolen or prohibited items under PACE. The meaning of ‘reasonable suspicion’ is found in Code A.

There must be some basis for the officer’s belief, related to you personally, which can be considered and evaluated by an objective third person. Mere suspicion based on hunch or instinct might justify observation but cannot justify a search.

However, reasonable suspicion can sometimes exist without specific information or intelligence and on the basis of some level of generalisation stemming from the behaviour of a person. For example, if an officer encounters someone on the street at night obviously trying to hide something, this clearly constitutes conduct that might reasonably lead the officer to suspect that stolen or prohibited articles are being carried.

The power must be used fairly, responsibly, with respect for people being searched and without unlawful discrimination. This would include discrimination on grounds of race, colour, ethnic origin, nationality or national origin. Accordingly, reasonable grounds for suspicion cannot be based solely on attitudes or prejudices towards certain types of people, such as membership of a group within which offenders of a certain kind are relatively common - for example, young football fans. Nor can it be based solely on your skin colour, age, hairstyle, mode of dress or previous convictions.

Is it an offence to cover your face when filmed by police, for example at railway stations.

Unfortunately you're guilty just on the arresting officer's say so. They don't have to provide any evidence apart from their opinion, which is taken as fact and there is no defense.

This has got be the worst breach of everything that is supposed to underpin our laws and EU laws as well

When we get standing sorted the thing to sort out after that is to get rid of laws like this and the other laws that only apply to football fans.

like...

You can have a drink if you're a rugby fan but you can't if you're watching football etc

I had a similar scenario last year when Millwall visited ashton gate, the pig completed an s60 search and (and took personal details) then proceeded to ask me "if had anything on me that i shouldnt have".............With that i whipped out me toothbrush. I had stayed at my mates the night before (CHALKY).

It was one of the funniest mooments of my life to se his face..........he thought i was taking the piss and he nearly arrested me for waisting police time....UNBELIEVABLE :lol:

Say if you actually hadn't been drinking and they arrested you for drunk and disorderly just because you refused to tell them your personal details during a Section 60 could you provide evidence that shows that you weren't drinking?

If not then that is a trouting disgrace!

That aside, it's shocking that they don't have to take a breath sample to determine if you are in fact drunk and if so how drunk you actually are when you've been arrested on suspision of being drunk at football. I know it would cost a lot and be a lot of trouble (compared to just taking the punishment on the chin) but surely if you went up through the courts appealing then your punishment would have to be overturned.

This is the first time I have seen this thread.

I got a S60 along with about 30-40 other Man United fans at Derby train station the other week when we played there. We got off the train, up some steps onto the bridge, to be met by about 20 or so coppers. They made a circle around us and we stood there for about 10 minutes doing nothing. Then some big cheese officer came with a woman holding a video camera.

Everybody got a S60 apart from 10 older men who were together aged in their 50-60s. They took all my personal details, even wrote down that I was wearing a black Helly Hansen jacket and wore white Nike trainers. The police officer also searched my wallet and asked "Why do you have 2 tickets?" I was gunna reply "why does it matter" but thought better of it and said "I'm meeting a lad here who got a different train." which I was.

The first couple of people searched had to say their name to the video recorder filming them. Whats all that about? They never asked.... I mean, TOLD me to do that. So I avoided the embarrassment.

I asked one of them why they were doing all this and he said "Manchester United have a reputation and it is a common practice when teams like Man United and Chelsea play here."

Nobody got arrested.

At birmingham new street they did that and had a camera and aparantely my mate got on sky sports news getting searched. Don't know if it was the same with you on derby.

But going back to derby, my mate was on that train (one that got in at about 11) where you all got searched and put in a pub of there choice, but they couldn't fit everyone in one pub. So put the lads who didn't get in, in another pub which was the one I went to and locked us all in (apart from the park lookalike who was aloud to leave - i wonder why.)

Was very suprised I didn't get stopped and searched when I got to derby. Probably because I was walking through with some women.